Cosmetic WeBlog

Reninds me of back when I had the psycho roomate who worked at the
Origins counter. Needless to say, EVERYTHING the woman had came from
Origins. She had a bottle of something (I don't remember what now,
having done my best to forget that whole time :-D) that had 'Peach
Essential Oil' in it's list of contents. Only problem is... say it
with me now... there IS no such thing as Peach Essential oil! Made me
really trust everything else they made, you know what I mean?

Disclaimer: CosmeticInfo, it's owner and moderators have no business
association with any product-whether tangible or intangible-that is offered
for sale on the CosmeticInfo list unless otherwise stated. ALL
correspondence about any ad shall be done off list to the contact supplied
by the advertiser.
I want to buy some M&P soap directly from the manufacturer, but
their minimum order is pretty crazy, so I wanted to see if we can get
a co-op going. The descriptions of the soaps are copied here with the
permission of the manufacturer. Let's set a closing date on this of
Saturday, Dec 7th, so that I can order on Monday the 9th.
Note that these prices do include the shipping from
manufacturer to us, and our handling/packaging costs, but do NOT include
shipping from us to you. We will calculate that when you order.
Co-op for 2lb M&P soap blocks, 18 per case = 36lbs
Type of soap $ per case approx $ per lb
Clear 74.25 2.06 per lb
White 74.25 2.06 per lb
Olive oil 87.75 2.44 per lb
Castile 93.15 2.59 per lb
Goat's Milk 82.35 2.29 per lb
Oatmeal 85.05 2.36 per lb
Aloe Vera 80.25 2.23 per lb
Honey 80.25 2.23 per lb
Extra Clear 81.00 2.25 per lb
Low Sweat like Cold Process 78.75 2.19 per lb
Low Sweat Clear 78.75 2.19 per lb
Shaving Soap 82.35 2.29 per lb
Case lots only for these prices. Maybe we can do split cases if there is
enough interest.
Shipping costs to you will be advised.
We are very happy to offer you these new high quality bases.
* 100% Pure Glycerine Soap
* Only the Finest Natural Vegetable Oil Recipe
* 20% Kosher Glycerine Added
* Hypo-Allergenic
* Non-Comedogenic
* No Animal Testing
* No Animal Products (unless you ask for milk to be added)
* No Detergents
* No Sulfates
* No Surfactants
* No Alcohol
* No Sugar solutions
Clear Glycerine soap base: ("natural" formula 20% added Glycerine,
mainly Coconut oil) Our soap is 100% pure soap with
only the finest natural vegetable oils. We never have any animal
testing, animal products (other than milk in our goat's
milk soap), no detergents, no surfactants (except our extra clear), No
sulfates, no alcohol, and no sugar solutions.
White Glycerine soap base: (opaque "natural" formula 20% added
Glycerine, mainly Coconut oil) This is
our white soap base that is very similar in formula to the clear soap.
All the great things a melt and pour should be
only white!
Olive Oil soap base: (20% kosher grade A extra virgin olive oil) Olive
oil is known to create a soap that moisturizes
the skin and has a great lather. Our olive oil soap base is almost the
exact same formulation as our clear soap base;
the difference is that we have replaced 20% of our other vegetable oils
by olive oil. This product behaves the same as
the clear melt and pour when melted. Due to the high content of olive
oil a light attractive pale yellow color may be
noticeable which will darken slightly in time.
Castile soap base: (25-30% kosher grade A extra virgin olive oil)
Castile soap is the old time soap made for hundreds
of years. Our castile soap base is made from mainly olive oil. It
differs from our other opaque soaps due to the
replacing most of the coconut oil with olive oil. We also modified the
amounts of our other ingredients somewhat so that
the Castile base is not a paste.
Goat's Milk soap base: (10% refrigerated liquid Vitamin D Goat's Milk)
Softens skin and has a delicate creamy lather.
Our Goat's Milk soap is made with real liquid goat's milk as found in
your neighborhood grocery store. It is a creamy
"custard" color.
Oatmeal soap base: (made with a large percentage of oatmeal) Oatmeal
soap is known to exfoliate the skin along with
a great moisturizing lather.
Warning: Oatmeal soap base needs to be heated very slowly over a small
flame. You must also put a small amount of water
or glycerine in the bottom of the pot when melting or remelting due to
the large amount of oatmeal. The oatmeal can burn;
give off a foul odor, or both.
Aloe Vera soap base: (made with 5% added Aloe Vera Gel) Aloe Vera is
known for its healing properties for skin burns
and abrasions. Now you can craft soap with real aloe gel in Melt and
Pour. Aloe Vera gel is added to our loved clear
base to make greenish base. This soap base is very soothing and
cleansing to the skin.
Honey soap base: (made with 10% added 100% Pure Natural Grade A
Honey) A generous amount of soothing Honey has been
added to our clear soap base to make a light amber melt and pour base.
Our honey soap does vary in color depending on
the raw honey that we use. It is light to dark amber.
Extra Clear soap base: (25% added glycerine, great clarity)
Note: You might notice a bit of extra "sweating" (glycerine drawing the
moisture from the air) with this higher
glycerine formula.
Low Sweat Like Cold Process soap base: This base allows you to enjoy
the look of cold process in a Melt and
Pour! It is perfect for someone who wants to wrap their soap in
paper. This soap base is an opaque base that does very
well in humid climates with little to no sweating!
Low Sweat Clear: Latest and greatest soap base that is clear and also
low to no sweating! You can wrap this soap in
paper, and have it in a humid environment!
Shaving Soap: This is a clear soap base made to lather with loads of
luxurious lather, great for shaving or just for
someone who loves great heavy lather!
Lynda
Lynda@...
--
Lynda Sorenson
http://www.Luna-Aromatics.com

Happy birthday Jan as well as Happy Thanksgiving.
From north of the 49Th
Cathy Sutton

When a company formulates a new product do they...a) start with a basic
formula and tweak to get the desired results or ..b) pull ingredients that
they know will give the desired results and start from scratch?
ie - Origins whipped body cream contains 37 ingredients. The ingredient
list includes water (herbal infusions), 4 oils, 7 eo's, 7 emulsifiers, 7
preservatives with the balance being lubricants/skin feel products. Would
it be safe to assume they are using products that contain a combination of
ingredients?
Conversely, a similar cream from The Body Shop shows 17 ingredients --
water, 7 oils, 3 esters/emulsifiers, balance being skin feel & preservative.
In fact, a simple list similar to one that could be made at home.
Is there any advantage to numerous ingredients - say a synergistic action
from a combination or is it just hype? Or could it be they have a
combination product that provides what they need and is easy to use?
Thanks folks, have a wonderful stress-free Thanksgiving. Once every four
years I celebrate my birthday on TG, this is my year. Someone else cooks &
cleans :)
Jan Flood oakridge@...

One other thing, Kevin. If a person is using essential oils to make the
cologne would you still recommend 8-10% keeping in mind that many
Aromatherapists recommend no more than 3% because of the sensitization risk?
Pat.
Peace, Joy, Serenity
House of Scents tm. Body Oils, Fragrance Oils, Incense, Candles, Soap, Etc.
pat@...
http://www.houseofscents.com/

Dear Members,
I have made an bodycream containing polawax and filled it in 3 layer
plastic tube for stability and compatabilty of the product.
At room temp of 20-25 degree centigrade the product was good.But at
the temp range of 40-50 degree centigrade and relative humidity of
60 %,the tube is found to be bulged(fat).The product is filled at
temp 42-45 degree centigrade and the tube is sealed manually at 180
degree centigrade.Contact time for sealing the tube is 2sec.
Another observation of mine is that with similiar formulation,the
tube found to be fine with above condition.What may be the reason for
bulging of the tube at raised temperature?
I checked the tube for aeration of the product .The product bulk
density is 0.985.Even after removing the product from tube ,the final
appearance of the tube is found to be buldged.
Please help me to identifying the problem and finding the solution
for the packaging of my product.
Thanks And Regards
jbbhat

Yvonne,
Chemically they are different but functionally they sometimes can be
used interchangeably. Go ahead and use the PG that you have and see if
it works for you.
Kevin Young
KY Labs
Innovators of Fine Personal Products
www.kylabs.com

Julie,
First off let me say that only synthetic oxides are approved for use in
personal care products. The ingredient statement therefore tells me that
they are lying. Glycerin is not a preservative and actually helps
support microbial growth as a nutrient. As far as the rest of it goes
you pretty well already know the answers. Just remember P. T. Barnum
parting fools from their money.
Kevin Young
KY Labs
Innovators of Fine Personal Products
www.kylabs.com

Colin,
I do not know what your capabilities are for producing such a product
but I can tell you how it is done commercially. Colognes typically have
8-10%W/W fragrance oils in a vehicle containing SD Alcohol and maybe a
glycol like propylene glycol. The glycol is typically up to 10%. Aqueous
dye solutions are used to color the final product. Now comes the fun.
The ingredients are first combined in a vessel and then bentonite clay
is added. This mixture is stirred vigorously and held for 24 hours. It
is then chilled and filtered. The addition of the clay in the process is
called maceration and is used to clarify the final solution.
Now, the only things that you need to do are source your fragrance oils,
propylene glycol and alcohol. You can leave off the maceration if
desired.
Hope this helps you out.
Kevin Young
KY Labs
Innovators of Fine Personal Products
www.kylabs.com

I purchased a bottle of a bath water coloring agent that is being
sold for the single purpose to do only that....color water/color
therapy. They have their ingredients listed as : Water, glycerin
and natural oxides. This product doesn't state it has a
preservative so are we "assuming" they're using glycerin for that
purpose? Also, aside from the bad labeling...I'm curious how one
makes this liquid coloring agent as it remains "mixed" (no
separation), must have a "forever" shelf life (sans preservative),
etc. Would you please lightly explain how to make a liquid coloring
agent that doesn't stain the tub or clothing, and is comprised of
nothing synthetic? I'm curious how this is done with so few
ingredients and yet "apparently" is "safe" for all ages PLUS rinses
down the drain without need for scrubbing "dyed" bathtubs, etc.
Thanks.
JulieInIdaho

Hi
Firstly let me introduce myself, my name is Colin and I live in
Aberdeen, Scotland (so please excuse my English spelling). I have
been lurking on this group for a few weeks now and I have to say what
a knowledgeable group of people you are.
I have had a request from one of my customers to make them a Cologne
and my query is this, has anyone got a decent formula for cologne and
how do I make it? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Ahhhh! It's Neways we're talking about here....a good freind of mine sells
their products and is forever pushing new brochures and "wonder creams" of
theirs at me....
I have a real hard time with them....they use the worst kind of scare
tactics as marketing that I have seen in years...I watched an introductory
video which, if you believed it, would have you believing that every other
cosmetic and toiletry on the market will give you cancerand only their
sacred chemists have the secret of dafe, clean and youth preserving
potions......their prices are exorborant...and the ingredient list on their
"natural" roomsprays and stuff....well....let's say that the "natural"
ingredients come right at the bottom of the list....and the ones they choose
show no rational that my training in herbalism can follow at all....and the
fragnances used in them owe little to nature...a great predominance of
"grape"....nice...but....and on top of that their "gentle" shower gel gave
me a rash.....
I was particulalry fascinated with one "training" video that showed their
"simple" skin care range...containing 15 steps!!!!!! Wow!
On top of that, my friend is contiually going to "private info and training
evenings" where they are told a whole different story to what is printed on
the catalogues etc...and many of the products are sold to them as having all
sorts of wierd and wonderful and totally unproven effects....it is then
suggested that they should be telling their customers this...and all of this
comes with the company disclaimer that Neways does not officially make these
claims (therapeutic goods act etc).
In other words, the home sellers are encouraged to make claims for the
products that Neways can't and won't for legal reasons...
(EG their mouthwash...which my friend was told will double as an antiseptic
eyewash, a first aid treatment for wounds on animals and humans...and a
great household cleaner for difficult stains! I couldn't quite work out why
from the ingredient list...I should get a copy of it and post it here for
the chemists to have a look at.....a progesterone cream that doubles as an
arthritis remedy and a pain rub for sore muscles....the list goes on....)
Sometimes I wish I was unscrupulous.....
Ambrosia

Hi, I'm coming out of lurkdom to find a answer. Could anyone tell me what
the difference is between dipropylene glycol and propylene glycol. I'm set
to make incense but after reviewing I see I only have propylene glycol. Is
it save to use? Looking on the internet tells me that both are used to
dilute fragrances. As usual...I'm confused!
Thanks,
Yvonne

Hi Kathleen.
enjoyed the professionalism of your group as a whole, the incredible talent
assembled, and the level of discussion that abounds. <snip
without a doubt the one with the greatest value. Hopefully I shall even be
able to contribute some day.
Welcome to the group and thanks for your kind words. We have been blessed
with some of the most talented people in the industry with the
chemists-Maurice, Kevin, and David-that post here. Besides answering
questions, Maurice has provided so many files that are stored in our file
section that we had to start a second group to handle the overflow.
The membership is a very talented bunch as well and it gives a great sense
of accomplishment to see them grow in their knowledge and experience as time
goes by. Everyone on this list, from the chemists to the members are very
liberal in sharing their knowledge. This list has lived up to all my
expectations and in many ways surpassed them. For this I will be forever
grateful to the chemists and everyone else that participates.
While I am the owner of the list, I am like the majority of the membership
in that I am trying to learn as much as I can about the cosmetic/toiletry
business. The bulk of what I currently know, I have learned from the
chemists, much of this from Maurice as he has taken the time to explain
things to me in layman's terms. This has helped since I don't have a
chemistry background.
I hope you take full advantage of the list. Take a look in the files area
that has a wealth of information and our links area where you will find
links to the regulatory bodies that govern our industry.
Pat.
Peace, Joy, Serenity
House of Scents tm. Body Oils, Fragrance Oils, Incense, Candles, Soap, Etc.
pat@...
http://www.houseofscents.com/

My apologies to the group -
Jen, I've been trying to reach you privately regarding this great sale. I'm
hoping to place an order before the deadline but can't seem to get through -
could you please e-mail me back privately? I have some questions.
~Denise~

I imagine that Dromaius Oil is the oil from the Dromaius
novaehollandiae (Emu). Therefore Dromaius Oil is Emu Oil.
Emu Oil is safe to use in cosmetics. Emu Oil is found all over. In
fact, I see ads for Emu Oil on this list.
Maurice

Hello:
Can anyone tell me what this oil is, any safety issues, and if it is
safe to use, where can it be found?
Debbie

Greeting and Salutations:
I am new to this group and quite frankly hadn't planned on posting for several
months as I figured that would be how long it would take me to get up to speed.
But let me just say that after reading several digests of posts, I have enjoyed
the professionalism of your group as a whole, the incredible talent assembled,
and the level of discussion that abounds. I was a chemistry student in college
(stopped 2 quarters short of a B.S., took 10 years off, and then worked for a
B.S. in Social Relations, a combination of Psyc, Soc, & Anthro) and I am pleased
that I not only remember quite a bit of my chemistry, but I am really looking
forward to putting on some goggles and grabbing a stirring rod.
Of all the groups of which I am a member, I can tell that this one is without a
doubt the one with the greatest value. Hopefully I shall even be able to
contribute some day.
Peace,
Kathleen Brady

Hi everyone,
I have been a member for some time but have not had anything to contribute until
now. I went to this site and decided to ask for some proof of their claims. I
focused on one ingredient to make it easier to validate. So I chose Tallow. I
asked for some documentation of their claims and this is the reply I got.

I don't believe so, but without the question it is difficult to know what
Maurice was referring to with the above answer. According to FDA, "articles
intended for use in the diagnosis, cure, mitigation, treatment, or
prevention of disease in man or other animals" is considered a drug. I
believe that if you make the claim that a product or ingredient heals, you
are falling within that definition of the FDA and would be required to
supply the necessary proof to make the drug claim.
Pat.
Peace, Joy, Serenity
House of Scents tm. Body Oils, Fragrance Oils, Incense, Candles, Soap, Etc.
pat@...
http://www.houseofscents.com/

Hi Kevin
I think it will be a long time before I can afford a warring blender:-)
I tried the Super Blue today and so far no problems. I rang Warner Jenkinson
just to be on the safe side and they said that this was stable over most pH
ranges so this will do me fine.
Pam
Pam,
Try adding just a slight bit of an alkali to your NaCl to move the pH to
the alkaline side. It won't take much Again, NaCl is neutral and should
not cause you a problem. Use a Waring Blendor or an Osterizer to first
grind a pellet or two of NaOH into a portion of the NaCl before adding
the remainder of the NaCl. Use a Mixmaster or the equivalent to mix your
alkaline NaCl to the remainder of the NaCl and then add your colors.
Hope this helps.
Regards,
Kevin Young
KY Labs
Innovators of Fine Personal Products

Pam,
Ultramarines are alkali stable but not acid stable. Sodium chloride is
neither acid nor alkali. It is an electrolyte. Your sesquicarbonate may
be causing the problem because it is not fully neutralized and has a
free acid group on it. Ultramarines are stable at pH greater than 7.2.
Mango violet will turn brown in alkali media. It does not release any
gases like the ultramarines. Iron blue, aka Prussian blue, ferric
ferrocyanide, ferric ammonium ferrocyanide is both acid and alkali
stable but it is a very hard pigment and can be difficult to disperse
without specialized manufacturing equipment.
I hope this sheds some light on your color problems.
Kevin Young
KY Labs
Innovators of Fine Personal Products
www.kylabs.com

<<<<<<<<<<<If there is calendula Co2 in it, can I say it is healing?
No.
Why Not?
Because to do so implies that it is a drug which would need FDA approval,
that you don't have.
Pat, I am confused, are you contracting Maurice who stated the following
concerning a botanical in a product of another poster....
"The FDA does not recognize most botanicals as having this physiological
effect. Therefore your product is still a cosmetic."
From my research, Botanicals and Herbs are considered by many people to have
healing properties, and recorded throughout the centuries, but
it is not recognized by the FDA officially therefore
Calendula Co2 may be a healing product and used in a formular, and not
considered a "drug" according to FDA specs. There are thousands of
companies selling herbal remedies but are not classifed as "drugs" by the
FDA.
Sherry

Sorry, I've just answered my own question, the ultramrine does release
hydrogen sulfide when mixed with sodium chloride Now, if I use manganese
violet, will this cause any problems when I add the sesquicarbonate which is
an alkali? I believe it isn't stable in alkali products but what they do
they mean by this? I'm looking for a blue or purple colour so one other
alternative I have is Super blue C.I. No: 74160 which is acid resistant. Is
this super blue suitable to both acid and alkali?
Any help appreciated,
Pam

Can anyone tell me please which colour, ultramarine mauve or manganese
violet I should use in a bath salt with mainly sesquicarbonate and sodium
chloride please?
Thanks in advance
Pam

Marge,
Is Manuka a tea tree variety.
I have read about this before and am interested in it's properties.
If it is gentler - then I'll should be using it in my leave on products.
Thanks,
Bobbi ~
backhousia citriodora... there is research out there showing it is a much
more powerful antiseptic than teatree...because of it's extremely high
citral content...
BUT that same high citral content makes it extremely irritating to the
skin... we recommend its use in the diffuser and in room sprays, but not
in "on the skin" uses....
(we use Manuka eo with lavender as the antibacterials in our acne
blend....more effective than tea tree and gentler to the skin.)
Your source for superb Essential Oils, Aromatherapy
Accessories, Information, Books and more!
Visit us at: <http://www.naturesgift.com

Thank you! I like to help and I'm glad you think the formulary is helpful.
You may be interested in joining my newsletter mailing list
Hi, Angie!
You bet I am interested--I just joined. If your Newsletter is half as helpful
as your posts, I will become a formulator yet!!!
Thank you for inviting me,
Tina Marie

What kind of paints? I was pleasantly surprised that interior satin paint, a
latex, washed off as easily as it did with my homemade soap (no
fingernail-scraping needed, just gentle rubbing). That soap recipe had
approximately 74% lard. I am also curious what the answers to this thread
will be, as I know very little about other kinds of cleaners. - Katie

backhousia citriodora... there is research out there showing it is a much
more powerful antiseptic than teatree...because of it's extremely high
citral content...
BUT that same high citral content makes it extremely irritating to the
skin... we recommend its use in the diffuser and in room sprays, but not
in "on the skin" uses....
(we use Manuka eo with lavender as the antibacterials in our acne
blend....more effective than tea tree and gentler to the skin.)
Your source for superb Essential Oils, Aromatherapy
Accessories, Information, Books and more!
Visit us at: <http://www.naturesgift.com

Maurice, you make everything seem so simple. Here in Australia we
have a Dr Carl Quizinski (?) who is also an amazing man. You both
seem like a modern Dr Julius Sumner Miller, a legend! You make it all
so simple (science etc). Thankyou.
Louise

Good Morning,
I've been presented with a challenge from my daughter. She attends a vocational
school and was just accepted into the Painting and Decorating trade. She
mentioned to the teacher that I made soap and toiletries. The teacher asked if I
had a hand cleanser that would help inthe removal of paints and such from the
students hands. If I can formulate a product that will work, they will purchase
in large volume! (It doesn't hurt that I worked for the city and my mother still
works there with getting the contract!). Now, I don't want anyone to formulate
the product for me, just some advice on what possible surfactants and other
ingredients that may aid in paint removal YET be gentle.
Thank you!
Andrea
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.422 / Virus Database: 237 - Release Date: 11/20/2002

Because to do so implies that it is a drug which would need FDA approval,
that you don't have.
It may, and I'm sure their antioxidant does scavenge for free radicals. This
is the only sentence that gives me pause. Perhaps Maurice or someone else
can elaborate on it.
That is if you make the assumption that the cream is going to raise the
moisture content of your skin. Just marketing hype, Bobbi, don't let it get
to you.
Pat.
Peace, Joy, Serenity
House of Scents tm. Body Oils, Fragrance Oils, Incense, Candles, Soap, Etc.
pat@...
http://www.houseofscents.com/

Maurice, would it be possible to use the Lemon Myrtle Essential Oil as a
preservative in lotions, etc. ?
Thanks,
Maria

Hi All,
This is copy from a web site featured in one of the trade magazines this
month.
What are the regs regarding such statements for products other then soap?
On my lotion I list the ingredients and state that it is soothing and silky.
If there is calendula Co2 in it can I say it is healing? Why Not?
Thanks,
Bobbi ~
Faerie Creme
CR-012FC
Faerie Cream is an anti-wrinkle face creme combines luxury with
effectiveness which leaves the skin in a new aura. It provides skin
rejuvenation from the effects of stress, UV radiation, environmental damage
and aging. It stimulates the remodeling and contraction of collagen fibers,
protects elastic fibers against enzyme breakdown and scavenges free
radicals. It moisturizes, strengthens, restores former tone and suppleness
and promotes anti-wrinkle activity in the skin. The effects of aging are
smoothed and the skin becomes younger looking. The face will also become
less susceptible to chapping and cracking as the moisture content of the
skin is raised and flexibility increased. 4 oz.
Retail price: 26.40

but has a slight waxy feel, rather than the silky feel of the original. The
consistency & texture is fine.
Ingredients:
Water part - 60%
Oil part - 20.75%
Glycerin - 10%
Glyceryl Monostearate - 5%
ProLipid 141 - 2.5%
Glycol Stearate SE - 2.5%
Also added VitE, Silk amino acids, & Germall Plus.
What I should eliminate/change/add to lighten the waxy feel? Does the
Prolipid need a co-emulsifier or can it stand alone? (ISP Prolipid 141:
Glyceryl Stearate, Behenyl Alcohol, Palmitic Acid, Stearic Acid, Lecithin,
Lauryl Alcohol Myristyl Alcohol & Cetyl Alcohol)
Thanks!
Jan Flood oakridge@...

First, let me say up front that I have never use Prolipid 141 nor have
I seen a good reason to use it.
That being said, I think you have WAY too much emulsifiers and those
emulsifiers are waxes.
Do you have any Polysorbate 20, 60, 80 or 85?
BTW, thanks for rephrasing the question. =8-)
Maurice

Also if its already been hydrolysed its already undergone a pretty
fierce reaction, and its not going to react again with water.
Dave E

Thank you Maurice. I shall try your formula.
Cathy Sutton

I just had a look at that site. Seems to me its an attempt at advertising their
products by scare tactics. I assume they are unable to sell anything without
doing that. Their products likely don't have much merit.
Cathy Sutton

Wow, what an excellent description, Maurice!
I'm saving the labeling information so I'll know how to answer next
time. Thanks for you help (again!)
Rachel

Kevin,you should send this to their contact email address, although it never
does any good to argue with these people.
Jay

In a message dated 11/22/02 6:56:35 AM Pacific Standard Time,
wizardtina@... writes:

Ambrosia-

You are VERY right! The important thing with carrier oil on acned skin
is to stick with the lighter textured ones, such as frac coconut. I
swear, I should sell the stuff, I use it for almost everything!
Myrtle has been around for a good while, in fact, and lots of studies
have been done. In his book, 'Plant Aromatics', Martin Watt recommends
not using more than a 0.015% dilution of Myrtle on a daily basis.
Best wishes-
Lynda
--
Lynda Sorenson
http://www.Luna-Aromatics.com

Thanks Ladies:
It will give me a place to start.
If anyone else out there has a simple formulation they would be
willing to share, I would greatly appreciate it.
Debbie

call it a polish) made of ground flower petals (for mild abrasion),
in a base of jojoba oil and vitamins, etc. to be very helpful for
unclogging plugged pores, without drying, and irratating the skin.

Here's one.
Toxicity of Australian essential oil Backhousia citriodora (Lemon
myrtle). Part 1. Antimicrobial activity and in vitro cytotoxicity.
Hayes AJ, Markovic B.
Food Chem Toxicol. 2002 Apr;40(4):535-43.
Chemical Safety and Applied Toxicology Laboratories, School of Safety
Science, The University of New South Wales, 2052, Sydney, Australia.
amanda.hayes@...
The antimicrobial and toxicological properties of the Australian
essential oil, lemon myrtle, (Backhousia citriodora) were investigated.
Lemon myrtle oil was shown to possess significant antimicrobial
activity against the organisms Staphylococcus aureus, Escherichia coli,
Pseudomonas aeruginosa, Candida albicans, methicillin-resistant S.
aureus (MRSA), Aspergillus niger, Klebsiella pneumoniae and
Propionibacterium acnes comparable to its major component-citral. An in
vitro toxicological study based on the MTS
(3-(4,5-dimethylthiazol-2-yl)-5-(3-carboxymethoxyphenyl)-2-(4-sulfopheny
l)-2H-tetrazolium) cytotoxicity assay was performed. In vitro
cytotoxicity testing indicated that both lemon myrtle oil and citral
had a very toxic effect against human cell lines: HepG2 (a
hepatocarcinoma-derived cell line); F1-73 (a fibroblast cell line
derived from normal skin) and primary cell cultures of human skin
fibroblasts. Cytotoxicity IC50 (50% inhibitory concentration) values
ranged from 0.008 to 0.014% (w/v) at 4 h to 0.003-0.012% (w/v) at 24 h
of exposure. The no-observed-adverse-effect level (NOAEL) for lemon
myrtle oil was calculated as 0.5 mg/l at 24 h exposure and the RfD
(reference dose) was determined as 0.01 mg/l. A product containing 1%
lemon myrtle oil was found to be low in toxicity and could potentially
be used in the formulation of topical antimicrobial products.
Maurice

Proteins are everywhere and all proteins are made up of about 20
different amino acids acids like Lysine, Arginine, Cystine, Asparagine,
etc.
http://dl.clackamas.cc.or.us/ch106-05/common.htm
Hair (keratin protein) and the whites of eggs (albumen protein) are
common proteins. What makes them look, behave and taste different is
the arrangement or sequencing of the amino acids.
I like to think of proteins as trains. A train has engines, passenger
cars, freight cars, tanks cars etc. The arrangement of these
individual cars tells use what kind of train we have. Like the train,
the arrangement or sequence of amino acids will tell us what kind of
protein we have.
Most all proteins used in the personal care industry are hydrolyzed
proteins. When a protein is hydrolyzed, the protein molecule is
chopped or broken up into smaller pieces or chunks. These pieces of
protein are called polypeptides.
Polypeptides are small sequences of amino acids. Polypeptides are
protein fragments. Proteins are composed of many amino acids and have
a very high molecular weight. Polypeptides are composed of just a few
amino acids and have a lower molecular weight. And amino acids are
single molecules and have very low molecular weight.
Hydrolyzed proteins are usually broken down by acids (acid hydrolysis)
or enzymes (enzyme hydrolysis). If you break down or hydrolyze the
protein completely, you have amino acids, if you have a partial
hydrolysis you have protein fragments, called polypeptides or
hydrolyzed protein.
Maurice

The proteins used in cosmetics are hydrolyzed proteins. I've been
adding hydrolyzed protein to shampoos and conditioners for about 22
years and haven't had any problems.
Maurice

From my scanty biochemical knowledge, most proteins change shape when heated
and "clump" similar to solidifying egg whites don't they? Could this be the
reason the hydrolysed proteins are supposed to be added during the cooldown
phase?
Ambrosia

I've had good results with teenage spotty skin by using presisely what you
wouldn't expect: oils.
Going on the theory that if you overstrip your skin, it simply gets
triggered to produce more oil....I thought I'd try the opposite:
And lo and behold it really seems to work!
The oil blend I now make for my teenage daughter and friends is a blend of
gently healing herbal oil infusions, lavender EO, lemon myrtle (Australia's
newsest herbal wonder antiseptic...much nicer than ti tree...but who knows
if they'll find it too sensitizing down the track too...I use only a few
drops in a 10ml bottle), frankincense EO and evening primrose.
I'm not selling the oil, so I'm passing on some of the ingredients for
further discussion with those of you who use EO's.
The newest reports on lemon myrtle sound great...but as usual, I haven't
found any scientific data let alone decent studies that have been done on
the stuff.....anyone seen anything?
As I said, I suspect that the main thing that works is using oil on the skin
in the evenings....it seems to reduce the skins own oil production.
My teenager certainly loves it...and it does markedly improve her
skin....and there's no beeswax which is said to "block" the pores, no water
to need emulsifiers etc.....
Ambrosia

Thanks for the links, but, no matter how I try to follow them I get a
message that says file are not found on this server.
Angie

the West Coast.ÿ A place down the street had it but has replaced it with another
product, Orisil I believe they said, which I could not find adequate
documentation on so I'm searching for Cab-O-Sil M5.
Try
E. T. Horn Company
Jim Calkin
16141 Heron Avenue
La Mirada, CA 90638
jcalkin@...
800 442-4676 or 714 523-8050
Fax: 714 670 6851
Maurice

Heidi,
I am reminded of the story of "Chicken Little" when I read web sites
like this one. This is 100% pure unadulterated BS. Purported facts are
taken from context to distort and skew the truth about cosmetic safety.
Who the hell is "Dr. Samuel Epstein"? Wanna bet he is behind this
website. It appears that he is the only one to gain from this. The
Nazi's used to say the truth will set you free. He should revisit
history.
Just my $0.001. He doesn't deserve $0.02.
Kevin Young
KY Labs
Innovators of Fine Personal Products
www.kylabs.com

Because most of their statements are not true or, at best, are half
truths. Misinformations for the gullable.
Maurice

Anyone have some Cab-O-Sil to sell or know where I can get some preferably on
the West Coast. A place down the street had it but has replaced it with another
product, Orisil I believe they said, which I could not find adequate
documentation on so I'm searching for Cab-O-Sil M5.
Thanks in advance.
Christine Logan
www.NaturesApprentice.com

By some strange happening, the formula for one of my best selling products
has disappeared. Gone from my master file, my working file and my note
file! Consequently, I'm trying to duplicate it from a label & tester.
Decided to eliminate the e-wax & add some conditioners to improve the
product.
Instead of e-wax, I used Glyceryl Monostearate, Prolipid 141 (ISP - which
includes Glyceryl Stearate, Stearic Acid, Lecithin & several Alcohols). In
addition, I added some Glycol Stearate SE. It is actually quite nice, but
has a slightly waxy feel, rather than the silky feel of the original - which
is what I want.
Could someone suggest which I should eliminate and/or change amounts to
bring it back in line? Does the Prolipid need a co-emulsifier? Ingredients
I used:
Water part - 60%
Oil part - 20.75%
Glycerin - 10%
ProLipid 141 - 2.5%
GS SE - 2.5%
Glyceryl Monostearate - 5%
Also added VitE, Silk amino acids, & Germaben Plus -- and yes :) I know it's
over 100% -- I was guessing at amounts when I started. Thanks!
Jan Flood oakridge@...

Take a look at this site:
http://www.hghoralspray.com/harmful_ingredients/toxic_ingredients.htm
If most of the statements on this site is true, why dont they list
the ingredients in the products they want to sell, for instance
their "Natural Bubble Bath"?
Heidi in Norway

When I called to ask questions I was lead to believe by the Croda salesman
that heat would destroy the basic humectant properties of the oats... I do
not know if this is true or not...when I told this person I was making
products for sensitive skin/ immune deficient individuals he wanted to tell
me about the new lanolins ( can't ever use those) so consider the source I
guess...
Andree

I was under the impression that you needed to add the hydrolyed oats at the
end of the lotion making/cool down process because they are heat
sensitive....Facts?
I don't want any bugs!!
Andree

Can't help you with formulations, but I can offer some tips on what you
need. If that makes any sense. :-D I have been doing skin care for a
living for the last God knows how many years.
Avoid the common mistake of formulating a cleanser that is 'drying' to
the skin. This only aggravates acne. The drier and flakier the surface
of the skin becomes, the more oil the sebaceous glands send out to
moisturize the skin's surface. Then all this extra oil combines with
the dry skin cells like bricks and mortar to clog pores. Think of acned
skin as already being out of balance, over-active and irritated, that is
why it makes a good home for the acne bacteria. What you want to do as
much as possible is soothe the skin with as gentle a cleanser as you can
find. Mind you, when I say gentle, I don't mean heavy and moisturizing.
Also, we are hearing more and more tales of Tea Tree oil sensitization,
especially coming out of Australia. This is partly due to the fact that
now EVERYTHING on the face of the earth has a Tea Tree version -
shampoos, cleansers, soaps, etc. Best to go with safe dilutions of more
tried and true Essential oils such as Lavender or German Chamomile
instead. Both good anti-bacterials and anti-inflammatories. But
remember 'safe dilution' are the key words in that sentence. I
personally especially like Manuka EO, but it is not tested, and I do
know of one instance of a friend sensitizing herself to it by using it
neat. And she KNEW better. I only use it in the tiniest dilution,
about an .01%.
Most people have the mind-set that the firmer and more disciplinarian
you are with your acned skin, the sooner it is going to settle down and
behave. So they scrub, over cleanse, apply alcohol, etc. and really
irritate the daylights out of it to try to punish it for misbehaving.
Give it positive attention instead, and be nice to it. Reduce your
stress levels, excersize, drink tons of water, get lots of fresh fruit
and veggies. Our state of mind IS reflected in our skin.
HTH_
Lynda

InfoWorld
November 21, 2002 5:18 AM
Microsoft issued a software patch Wednesday for what it described as a
"critical" new security vulnerability affecting most versions of its Windows
operating systems and
certain versions of the Internet Explorer (IE) Web browser.
The security flaw affects the Microsoft Data Access Components (MDAC), a
collection of components that provide database access for Windows platforms,
according to a
statement from Foundstone, a software vulnerability management company in
Mission Viejo, Calif., that discovered the flaw.
The vulnerability involves what's known as an "unchecked buffer" in the Remote
Data Services (RDS) component of MDAC. The faulty code is in a function called
the RDS
Data Stub, which is used to pull information from incoming HTTP requests and
create RDS commands, according to Microsoft.
An attacker could exploit the security weakness by sending an improperly
formatted HTTP request to the Data Stub that contained a surplus of data,
causing the buffer to
overflow and the attacker's data to be placed and run on the affected machine.
The vulnerability affects certain versions of Windows NT, Windows 2000 and
Windows Me, Microsoft said, and potentially other versions of its operating
system. It said
Windows XP users are not affected and need take no action.
The vulnerability received a severity rating of "critical" from Microsoft, the
highest possible rating under the company's new vulnerability rating system,
which was announced
Tuesday. Microsoft defines critical vulnerabilities as those "whose exploitation
could allow the propagation of an Internet worm such as Code Red or Nimda
without user
action." Many issues that were previously rated critical are now rated
"important," a new category in the rating system. Important vulnerabilities
could expose user data or
threaten system resources, according to Microsoft's new definitions.
The security hole in MDAC is particularly menacing because of the large number
of systems that are vulnerable to it and because of the ease with which existing
worms
such as Code Red or Nimda could be modified to take advantage of the newly
disclosed flaw, said Stuart McClure, Foundstone's president and chief technical
officer.
"What makes it really quite dangerous is that it can be easily added to a worm,"
McClure said.
"It's very much in line with Code Red and Nimda because of the attack vectors
and the ways that it attacks. But with this vulnerability both the server and
client component
can be attacked, as opposed to Code Red and Nimda, which basically exploited
server-based vulnerabilities and didn_t take advantage of a browser based
vulnerability like
this," he said.
Foundstone discovered the vulnerability in August and disclosed the information
to Microsoft at that time, McClure said.
The vulnerability affects MDAC Versions 2.1, 2.5 and 2.6, according to
Microsoft. MDAC is installed and implemented by default in Windows 2000, and
within the Windows
NT 4.0 option pack.
Machines running Internet Explorer versions 5.01, 5.5 and 6.0 are also affected
by the new vulnerability, Microsoft said.
Earlier versions of either MDAC or Internet Explorer that are no longer
supported may also be vulnerable, the software maker said.
Customers who are potentially affected are advised to review the appropriate
security bulletin, MS02-065, on Microsoft's Web site. The bulletin is at
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/treeview/default.asp?url=/technet/security/bull\
etin/MS02-065.asp
They should then download and install the software patch issued by Microsoft,
which is at
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/Release.asp?ReleaseID=44733
The same day that Microsoft warned of the MDAC flaw, the vendor released a
cumulative patch for IE that patches six other new flaws in addition to offering
all previously
issued security patches for the Web browser in one update. The cumulative patch
was release in bulletin MS02-066.
(http://www.microsoft.com/technet/security/bulletin/MS02-066.asp)
Microsoft deemed the cumulative patch "important," as opposed to the "critical"
rating it gave the MDAC flaw.
Four of the newly patched vulnerabilities could allow an attacker to read
certain files on a user's computer, while the other two would let an attacker
see what a user is
entering on Web sites or cause IE to fail, Microsoft said.

I totally agree with Steve Orofino. All water products are very difficult to
preserve. When this product was developed, many moons ago, Kathon CG was used.
This was before
Germall Plus. I've made up this product with Germall Plus and have had no
problems. The product was never challenge tested.
Maurice

Good morning, everyone!
great.
Oh, boy, an early Merry Christmas to me!!! You just gave me the greatest
gift! I was too embarrassed to come right out and ask for any known
recipes, so I attempted in my own feeble way to research ingredients myself.
I went through different websites I found, and looked in a few books I have,
trying to develop something according to properties listed. Thank you so
much for the formula information! I pay approximately $18.00 for a small
bottle of tail detangler which does not go very far. I am off to find the
ingredients you listed, and make my own.
With grateful thanks, as always,
Tina Marie

In a message dated 11/22/02 6:27:46 AM Pacific Standard Time, cathy2@...
writes:

so bear with me!
I'll try to be gentle.
honest--horse tails) that has conditioning and detangling properties.
The best detanglers and true hair conditioners are cationic and are
attracted to the anionic sites on the hair.
considering below?ÿ Can anyone recommend detangling and/or conditioning
ingredients that would be best for a leave-in hair product?
I have no idea what some of these ingredients are but it doesn't look
like an oil.
The following formulas were tested on human and horses. Both work
great.
========
Equine Leave In Conditioner
Part A
Deionized Water [Water] = 96.668%
Gafquat 755N [Polyquaternium-11] = 0.5%
Part B
Ritapan DL 50% (20 lb pail price) [Panthenol] = 0.001%
VegePlex VP-1750 [Calendula Officinalis Extract (and) Matricaria
Extract (and) Comfrey Extract (and) Golden Seal Root Extract (and) Hops
Extract (and) Horsetail Extract (and) Nettle Extract (and) Rosemary
Extract (and) Water] = 0.001%
Part C
T-Maz 20 [Polysorbate 20] = 0.2%
Fragrance AA001995 (Dreamsicle) [Fragrance] = 0.1%
Part D
Dow Corning 939 Cationic Emulsion [Amodimethicone (and) Trideceth-12
(and) Cetrimonium Chloride] = 2.5%
Part E
Kathon CG [Methylchloroisothiazolinone (and) Methylisothiazolinone] =
0.03%
========
Equine Detangler and Shine
Dow Corning 1401 Fluid (Drum) [Cyclomethicone (and) Dimethiconol] =
89.799%
Finsolv TN (Drum) [C12-15 Alkyl Benzoate] = 10%
Parsol MCX [Octinoxate] = 0.001%
Fragrance AA001995 (Dreamsicle) [Fragrance] = 0.2%
========
Maurice

Thanks to all for the replies...and yes...I have to use what is
available to me.. (in Canada if I don't want to go broke!)
here is my formula:
Wheat and Honey Shampoo
(ph.1)
45 % amphasol CG
.5% crothix
(ph 2 )
3% glycerin
1.5% hemp oil
1.5% raw honey
1% polysorbate20
(ph3)
41% distilled h20
(ph4)
2% hydrolyzed wheat protien
.5% panthenol
1% germaben II
2% EOs (equal parts Rosemary and Lavender)
I melted the crothix in the surfactant.
heated the h20
Added Ph 2 to Ph 1.
Added ph 3 to it and stirred till cooled and thick. Then added ph 4.
Stirred well and bottled.
(I don't think I've missed anything..my notes are a bit hard to read
due to spills)
Cathy Sutton

That's a very broad question. I suggest you go to the Cosmeticinfo
files area and read:
DOW Dipropylene Glycol Properties.pd

Can anyone give me a suggestion as to how to formulate a cleanser
for adult acne?
I have a client who wants this and I am not sure where to start.
Debbie

My DH is a martial arts publisher and Tai Chi practitioner. One of the
things that are always hanging around on shelves at home are bottles of weird
liquids that are used for rubbing on bruises and strains. I have always
ignored these, and indeed have *almost* become used to the smell of them
wafting off my beloved...
Recently though, I had a look at one. Then I had a look at the rest. Here
are the full label details from four of them exactly as they are printed,
including interesting spellings. They are all variations on the Tiger Balm
theme. I know they cannot be even remotely classified as cosmetics, but I
thought they might be of interest to members of this list...
MACAU'S HEALING OIL (Singapore Medicine Co)
is good for
Bronchitis
Burns
Bruises
Cuts
Catarrh
Coughs
Colds
Croup
Corns
Earache
Fever
Lame Back
Neuralgia
Piles
Rheumatism
Swellings
Stings of Insects or Reptiles
Sprains
Sore Throat
Toothache
Wounds of all descriptions
Formula
Camphor 3%
Spirit Turpentine 9%
Eucalyptus 0.5%
Liquid paraffin 87.5%
WHITE FLOWER EMBROCATION (Hoe Hin Pak Fah Yeow Mfy Ltd, Hong Kong)
provides relief from stuffed up feeling associated with with catarrh colds,
influenza and irritating throat.
Relieves headache, minor stomach ache and abdominal pain.
Temporarily relieves muscular pain.
Good for travel and motion sickness.
Antiseptic
Stops itching such as insect and mosquito bites.
Gives remedies to inflammation pimples, burns, scalds and cuts.
Helps to stop bleeding associated with minor wounds.
Refreshing.
Contents
Wintergreen oil
Menthol crystal
Eucalyptus oil
Peppermint oil
Camphor
Lavender oil
BAMBOO GREEN OIL (Singapore Pak Hee Medicine Factory)
For all Wind troubles, Sprains, Mumbness, Cramps, Back Ache, Headache,
Rheumatism, Cough.
Made of high grade Chinese herb, using century old Taoism temple
prescription. It is mild and applicable to a wild variety of sickness.
Efficacy
Rheumatism, bone ache, bone fractures, dizziness, cold, headache, bruise,
cramp, spasm, coughs, seasickness, nausea, faint, diarrhea, abdominal pain,
heart and lung pain, insect bites.
Menthol crystal 26%
Eucalyptus Oil 12%
Lavender Oil 0.5%
Camphor 12%
Methyl Salicylate 20%
White Oil 29.5%
WISEST OIL (Lee Kam Wing Martial Arts Sports Association, Hong Kong)
Heaven will know the conscience - Nobody can realize the manufacture.
An unique good prescription of the Northern Shaolin Seven-Star Mantis Style
for aches-killing and Arthrolithiasis-eliminating in application-external,
which is refined by Master Lee Kam Wing who adapts precious Chinese medicine
from the bottom of his heart.
The notable effectiveness of the Wisest Oil which gives actions on
tendon-relieving, blood-circulating, hematoma-dissipating and aches-killing
has been a good remedy for patients.
Administration
For application-external only.
Use Wisest Oil to brush slightly and massage onto the inflected part.
Permeate cottons with Wisest Oil to spread over external surface of the
inflected part for intense pain.
Indication
Rheumatism Bone pain
Nervous paraesthesia
Tendon injury
Mucle swelling and pain
Dizziness and headache
Menstrual abdomenal pain
Arthritic pain
Back and leg pain
Ingredient
Pamax notoginseng
Lycopus lucidus
Rheum officinale
Casalpinia Sappen
Siler divanicatum
Nepeta japonica
Polypodium fortunei Kze
Phellodendron amurense
Angelica acutloba
Carthamus tinctorius
Pistacia lentiscus
Inula helenium
Fresh Rehmannia glutinosa
Commiphora myrrha
Calamus draco, Wild
Sanguisorba Ossicinalis L.
Of these four, the Bamboo Green oil smells quite pleasant, with little of the
traditional 'linament' smell of the others. Having had a quick test of all
of them, I can report that it is also the only one that continues to smell
relatively pleasant after it has been lingering on clothes for a few hours.
Rose
The London Soap Company

This may be a stupid question, but what's the difference between
Propylene Glycol & Dipropylene Glycol?
Debbie

I'm also curious to see if there's a definitive answer on this.
I told Angie that it would probably be easier to list the gel and
lotion ingredients separately, but that I thought it could be done
either way. We both agreed it'd probably be better to get an expert
opinion. :) I'm embarrassed to say that it never even occurred to me
to wonder if this should be labeled differently from a normal lotion.
Is there a preferred format for a product that contains 2 or more
separate components? For example, those newer creams that come in
bottles with dual chambers, each containing a different
formula...when you press the pump, the two blend together in your
hand. Is there one ingredient list or two?
Thanks for any advice,
Rachel Ratledge

This may have been lost in the shuffle - hehe
Sorry, I should have given the link. It's Rachel at The Buying Group
www.the-buying-group.com

Hello, everyone, and an early Happy Thanksgiving!
I am admittedly a beginner in formulating products, but am trying really hard,
so bear with me! I am attempting to make a thick, leave-in oil for very coarse
hair (to be honest--horse tails) that has conditioning and detangling
properties. Since I will not be rinsing, am I on the right track with the
ingredients I am considering below? Can anyone recommend detangling and/or
conditioning ingredients that would be best for a leave-in hair product?
Aloe Vera gel
Provitamin B5
Propyltrimonium
Behentrimonium
Soy quat
Jojoba oil
Vitamin E Tocopheral
Paraben-DU
Hydrolyzed Wheat Protein or Angie's "LiproWheat"
Any advice would be greatly appreciated! Thank you in advance!
God bless,
Tina Marie

According to Dr Weil, a physician, anica is used diluted in oil, as a remedy
for sore muscles, sprains, etc, and should not be used on broken skin.
Your recipe:
Sometimes, it is the "temperature of the bases" that leads to seperation, at
least in my experience it has. having the bases the same temperature when
combining helps a lot, higher temperatures tend to seperate. Adding the
emulsfier lecithin at a lower temperature helps as well
Glycerin, water, are heated together to 180 F degrees, then borax is mixed
in.
The oils and waxes and butters are also melted together to 180 F degrees,
and should be all melted, and the lecithin is mixed in AFTER it has cooled
down to 120 F.
Cooling the water base to 120 F, add a preservative such as Germall Plus,
then combine the two slowly, and using a stick blender or blender on Low,
the mixture should combine and not seperate.
hth
Sherry
Natural Care E books

I am Looking for a natural or naturally derived (no smell) fixative for
perfume has anyone heard of any recent developments in this area. We
would like to enhance the staying power of our only essential oil based
perfume. without becoming an 'elevator killer'
has anyone worked with something worth checking out?
Thanks M Wilson
On Wednesday, November 20, 2002, at 01:01 AM,

Hi Cindy,
I believe Jan just stopped selling to the public. I heard she still sells to
her
distributors. I tried looking at what she has on sale and was unable to access
the products.
HTH, Sherry

Now mind you I'm not a chemist, nor do I play one on the web, but I don't
think beeswax/borax is that stable of an emulsifier. You may want to sub or
add ewax or another primary emulsifier. I'm sure Angie, Pat, Maurice or
Kevin (or someone else too) will chime in with a more scientific
explanation.
Andrea

Disclaimer: CosmeticInfo, it's owner and moderators have no business
association with any product-whether tangible or intangible-that is
offered
for sale on the CosmeticInfo list unless otherwise stated. ALL
correspondence
about any ad shall be done off list to the contact supplied by the
advertiser.
NOVEMBER SPECIALS
The Soap Goat Soap Shop
http://www.thesoapgoat.com
THIS JUST IN!!
SHRINK WRAP BAGS
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6" x 6.5" Shrink Wrap Bags - Box of 500 only $11.99
Gift Basket Dome Shrink Wrap - Lot of 100 & 500
http://www.thesoapgoat.com/nbags.html
LITTLE MILK/JUICE JUGS
In stock and ready for immediate shipping
http://www.thesoapgoat.com/nprebuys.html
http://www.thesoapgoat.com/nbags.html
POPPY SEEDS
Great for Scrubby soaps
http://www.thesoapgoat.com/nherbs.html
OUR NOVEMBER SPECIALS:
http://www.thesoapgoat.com/nspecials.html
MILKY WAY CHRISTMAS MOLDS - $5.00 each tray
Gift Box, Peace, Christmas Tree & Joy
LIQUID GREEN COLOURANT - 15% Off each size
COLOUR NUGGETS - 15% Off
Clear & Pearl Green - and - Clear & Pearl Christmas Red
FRAGRANCE OIL - 20% Off each size
Our Newest Fragrance Oil - AMERETTO ON THE ROCKS.
The perfect holiday (and all year `round) fragrance. Men and Woman go
nuts over this one!
MELT AND POUR GLYCERIN SOAP BASE - 15% Off
Our Orange Extract MP is on sale this month.
GOAT MILK SOAP BARS - $1.99 each
Apple Jack & Orange Peel, Oatmeal Milk & Honey and Relaxing bars.
PRESS AND BREW TEA BAGS - 20% Off
Our Large Tea Bags are now on sale - just in time for gift giving!
Our 50, 100 and 1000 lot bags are on sale now!
CUTTERS - 15% Off
Our soap making curlers are 15% off all November.
More Clearance Items and Specials can be found on both our Garage
Sale Pages, and on our Special Page.
http://www.thesoapgoat.com/ngarage.html
http://www.thesoapgoat.com/nspecials.html
Happy Soaping!
Monique & The Soap Goat Crew.
http://www.thesoapgoat.com

I'm confused. I thought Jens Lab was closed. ?? Does anyone know what is
going on?
Cindy
Jen asked me to post this.
Huge short term temporary sale on Labcolours. This is the perfect
opportunity to try them out or stock up on them for 30% off!!!!!
Go here for orders.http://JensSale.homestead.com/
Thanks
Cathy Sutton

this is my recipie for a cream-seems to do fine, then it separates-
liquid comes to the top after a while, and I can't figure out if it's
the water, glycerin, or oil that separates-what should I do? Cut back
on what, or add what?? I've tried less water, but it still does it-a
bit less, but maybe I need to cut back a lot-well, here it is-
4 ounces beeswax
1 cup coconut oil-
2 1/2 oz shea
1 1/2 oz cocoa butter
1 1/2 cups veg oil
1/2 cup lethitin
1 cup glycerin
1 3/4 cups water
1 tsp borax
any ideas?? Help! Should I add more beeswax? This never totally
separates, unless I store it in the fridge-then, upon getting to room
temp, it will separate worse than before.
Cindy:)

chemicals to meet the needs of this client?ÿ Any supplier recommendations are
welcome.
Induchem sells a line of "tanning accelerators" under the "Unipertan"
trade name
Unipertan P-24 (Hydrolyzed Collagen (and) Tyrosine (and) Riboflavin)
Unipertan P-242 (Hydrolyzed Collagen (and) Tyrosine (and) Adenosine
Triphosphate)
Unipertan VEG-24 (Butylene glycol (and) Acetyl Tyrosine (and)
Hydrolyzed vegetable protein (and) Riboflavin)
Unipertan P-2002 (Hydrolyzed Collagen (and) Acetyl Tyrosine (and)
Adenosine Triphosphate (and) Riboflavin)
Unipertan VEG 2002 (Butylene glycol (and) Acetyl Tyrosine (and)
Hydrolyzed vegetable protein (and) Adenosine Triphosphate (and)
Riboflavin)
Unipertan VEG-242 (Butylene glycol (and) Acetyl Tyrosine (and)
Hydrolyzed vegetable protein (and) Adenosine Triphosphate)
In the USA, Induchem products are distributed by
Lipo Chemicals Inc.
207 19th Avenue
07504 Paterson N.J.
Telephone +1/973-345 86 00
Fax +1/973-345 54 92
Web www.lipochemicals.com
Tanning accelerators are new, unapproved drugs.
"[A]ny product purporting to "accelerate the tanning process" or
"stimulate the production of melanin" is claiming to affect the
structure and function of the body and, therefore, is a drug [Section
201(g) of the Federal, Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act (the Act)]."
http://www.fda.gov/foi/warning_letters/m2673n.pdf
http://www.fda.gov/foi/warning_letters/d1078b.pdf
http://www.fda.gov/foi/warning_letters/d1550b.pdf
Maurice

Listmom and any moderators are not responsible for any transactions.
Please contact me off list at perpleasures@...
Get ready for the Holiday season.
10% off all HDPE and LDPE Natural or White Cylinder, Natural or White
Bullet, and Cosmo Oval Clear bottles! All prices include caps! I carry 1oz
to 16 oz in the Cylinder, bullet, and 2oz to 16 oz in the Cosmo Oval
Bottles!
New in Hex and square clear glass jars with gold tone lids.
Check out all our containers. We carry 1/3oz Rollerballs with either white
or black caps, DW Clear in 1/2oz and 1oz. White flat DW and Domed in 1/2oz
to 8 oz, White 1/4oz lip balm pots, Clear compacts, and many more.
This sale will run the full month of November so take advantage of the
savings!
If you do not see something you would like, please contact me. I may have
some:)
Thanks,
Linda :)
www.perpleasures.com
Check out our November Container Sale!
---
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Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.419 / Virus Database: 235 - Release Date: 11/13/2002

Can't help much, but I do know that it's used for healing, mostly
sore muscles and inflamation--I don't know if it can be used on
abrasions-broken skin-or not-I'm thinking not, but I do know it's
very healing-I think I've seen it in homeopathic pill form, also,
though I've mostly seen it used topically in a cream or gel form--I
would like to get some of this too, but I haven't come across it for
sale-I think it's the root of the plant, but I could be very wrong-
wouldn't be the first time:) I hope someone answers your qustion, cuz
I'd like to know, too where to get it, and how do you incorporate it
in a formulation-like, boil the root(to much like work:) or what?
Cindy:)

WELCOME BACK!!
You were missed!!
Maurice

Hi All
Jen asked me to post this.
Huge short term temporary sale on Labcolours. This is the perfect
opportunity to try them out or stock up on them for 30% off!!!!!
Go here for orders.http://JensSale.homestead.com/
Thanks
Cathy Sutton

You haven't stated the amounts of oils/EO's you're using? When too
high in oils you can sometimes get a gelling (thickening) effect
before the oils are completely emulsified. Given time and the chance
to completely emulsify the gel disappears hence the product thins
out. Is it cloudy to start with? I would suggest trying an anionic
such as SLES or ALS or a combination along with the betaine.
Dave E

I have been asked by a tanning salon owner if I could make a lotion with a
tanning accelerator .
I make pretty darn good lotions - what would I have to purchase in the way of
chemicals to meet the needs of this client? Any supplier recommendations are
welcome.
Is this something that I should NOT do? And Why
The ETC part.........
The product that I can make is a moisturizing lotion with EMU oil in it. Seems
her supplier does not carry this any longer. There are 4 salons owned by this
gal. She wants to explore private label with me.
Are there any ingredients beyond some nice light weight oils, shea butter and
emu oil that I should be using?
Considering what tanning does to ones skin this stuff needs to be super
moisturizing. The Emu should help with some of the skin damage IMO.
If you have any experience in this area please LMK.
Thanks,
Bobbi ~
Bobbi Guerra
The Purple Sage
Fine Hand Made Bath & Body Products

I have been lurking and enjoying the list fo a while now.
Some friends are now distilling lavender oil and are wondering if
they need to add preservative to the hydrosol if they want to market
it as a toilet water. Sodium benzoate has been recommended . Any
thoughts.?

Our wonderful wooden molds are getting better! We have researched and found
Native Exotic Hardwoods! (IN STOCK NOW)
Molds will now be made from Ash, Maple and Oak. Truly a mold built for a
lifetime! No wood choices, due to what is in stock. Same price as the pine. $22
for the #3 pound mold.
We are supporting our local farmers!!! And bringing you a better bargain to
boot.
With Love and Gratitude!
Jan Schmidt 62301
www.sweetprairiesoap.com
jans@...
e-mail for paypal

Disclaimer: CosmeticInfo, it's owner and moderators have no business
association with any product-whether tangible or intangible-that is
offered for sale on the CosmeticInfo list unless otherwise stated. ALL
correspondence about any ad shall be done off list to the contact
supplied by the advertiser.
CosmeticInfo Owner
Hi,
As usual the listowner and moderators are not not responsible for the
outcome of any sales.
Kaolin clay-this white clay is very mild. Perfect for dry skin masks, and body
powders.
Bentonite-the most absorbent of clays. Ideal for oily skin face masks to draw
out impurities. Add to shaving soaps for superior "slip".
Both these clays are $4 a pound plus shipping USPS Priority or Fed Ex Ground
whichever is less. If you would like to order please email me at
soaplady(at)sbcglobal.net with your complete address. I take PayPal not
funded by a credit card and USPS Money Orders.
Thanks, Sherry Brown
Great-Grammy Woof
Having a Soapy Day!
Martinez CA 94553
Take a look at the only white cardboard soap displays on the internet:

In a message dated 11/20/02 5:57:02 AM Pacific Standard Time, cathy@...
writes:
Hi Cathy,
Hopefully, Maurice or Kevin or David will speak up here, but in my
experience, the culprit has usually been the eo or especially fo that I have
used. The problem usually occurs much sooner than a couple of weeks, more
like a couple of hours. I use cocamidopropyl betaine with other surfactants
in blends, so I can't address using cocamidopropyl betaine as the only
surfactant, but with the blends I never have any problem with the shampoo
thinning out or thickening up unless I add fo/eo. I am not sure about using
hemp oil or panthenol, but I can't see any problem with anything
else...except possibly rosemary? I seem to recollect a problem with rosemary
at one point. I do think the crothix is a bit tricky to use. But the
problem that I have had is that it will get gluey if too much is used. Also,
try analyzing the differences in your bubble bath and your shampoo to help
pinpoint the problem. So, basically, I don't really know :) Hopefully, our
chemists can help us out.
Angie
The Herbarie - Botanicals and Body Care
Natural Source & Specialty Bulk Ingredients...Exceptional Quality
at Wholesale Prices...visit us at http://www.theherbarie.com

I'm having a bit of a problem with my shampoos.
I am currently using cocamidoproply Betaine as the major ingredient
for my shampoo.
cocamidoproply betaine
distilled h20
hemp oil
crothix conditioning thickener
hydrolyzed wheat protien
pantenol
polysorbate20
germabenII
Essential oils (rosemary and lavender)
When I first make it..it is really thick..A couple of weeks later it
is really watery.
I'm using these ingredients at manufacturer recommended levels.
What the heck am I doing wrong?
Do I need to use different surfactants?
Should I add another surfactant to this mix?
Would salt used as a thickener act the same way?
Strangely, I've made bubble bath with similar ingredients with good
success....I'm baffled..but I am not well versed in the use of
surfactants..so perhaps this isn't so surprising....duh...
Thanks for any light anyone can shed on my problem.
Cathy Sutton

I was in on this thread on another list as well. I was concerned not only with
treated wood but with using "old kitchen cupboards" (recycled for molds). Seems
to me one would not know the history of the wood. Also, it is likely there
would be traces of paint or stain on such things even if sanded down. This
particular soaper did agree "treated wood," as it is called, is not good but
somehow using old wood and then sealing it and using it is just fine.
We had a fire nearby earlier in the week and there was some concern that
chemicals at this particular business may have gotten into the air. Until the
fire department discovered the chemical "bunker" had been untouched and was
safe, a warning went out to residents to keep windows shut and stay inside. It
was stressed that we cannot smell or preceive all dangerous chemicals in the air
and not to assume they were not there nor harmful just because we didn't.
Christine Logan
Nature's Apprentice

Hi All,
Treated wood is a concern. Here is what the EPA has to say:
<A
HREF="http://www.epa.gov/pesticides/citizens/cca_qa.htm#bkmrk4"
ov/pesticides/citizens/cca_qa.htm#bkmrk4</A
I also agree with all that Pat had to say about using pine or most other soft
woods, or hard woods, like oak. No harm there.
Angie
The Herbarie - Botanicals and Body Care
Natural Source & Specialty Bulk Ingredients...Exceptional Quality
at Wholesale Prices...visit us at http://www.theherbarie.com

Sherry, "treated wood (lumber)" is a term commonly used for the green
landscape wood and waterproof plywood. This type of material should never be
used in soap making. The EPA has found that anywhere this lumber has been
used on land that the soil is contaminated.
If you are talking about pine, oak, maple, etc. that has been sealed with
polyurethane, I don't think I would want to use that either in soap making,
whether cp or hp. I use wood (pine) molds when I make soap, which isn't very
often anymore. The only treatment I have ever used on the molds is to keep
them oiled. After a few oil treatments when new, they will release the soap,
then you just need to treat them when you make a batch of soap. Mine are
collapsible and that also helps.
I also
well.
There is nothing in pine that will hurt you. You are probably more likely to
find a sap pocket in a soft wood as opposed to a hard wood. You just don't
use that part, but even if you did, there is nothing in the sap that will
hurt you.
I believe what I have written is the correct answer, can't help you on the
chemist part though.
Pat.
Peace, Joy, Serenity
House of Scents tm. Body Oils, Fragrance Oils, Incense, Candles, Soap, Etc.
pat@...
http://www.houseofscents.com/

There is quite a discussion on another group about using "treated" wood as a
wood mold that is used in oven method hot processed soap.
I have stated that any treated wood would give off residue and fumes in this
process with oven temps [as low as 180 degrees to 200].
Others say you can treat it with polyureathene, [? spelling?] and such and
it will not give off a residue or fumes during the oven cooking. I also
suggested that soft woods such as pine, give off fumes and residue as well.
What is the correct answer? Could a chemist please respond?
Thanks, Sherry

Hi Maurice,
The product is in an 8oz PVC jar and layered alternately
(lotion,gel,lotion,gel). This product would not be shaken up to mix
and use. I have found that it is stable in that it does not mix once
packaged and will stay this way until usage begins. By this I mean
that the lotion and gel will evential intermingle and mix from
dipping it out of the container. Did I make any sense?
This is a product that Rachel at TBG has demonstrated and a picture
and formulas are on her website. If you would like to view it there,
follow the links to Body Parfait.
Thanks!
Angie

Pat--
They're similar to the texture of margarine...firmer than cream yet
not as hard as most balms would be. They tend to melt easily with
body heat, and hopefully absorb in a short span of time. Just
another version of the lotion bars in a more smooth finger-scoopable
mode.
JulieInIdaho

In a message dated 11/18/02 4:01:25 PM Pacific Standard Time, sherloc@...
writes:
Hi Patti,
Are you asking about the Conditioning Emulsifier (Behentrimonium Methosulfate
(and) Cetearyl Alcohol) and the Emulsifying Wax NF that I sell? If so, the
Conditioning Emulsifier and the Emulsifying Wax NF are both self-emulsifying
waxes. Generally speaking, you can substitute one for the other. For hair
conditioner, I prefer using the Conditioning Emulsifier only. They are both
simple to use, so it's what ever you like.
Hope this helps.
Angie
The Herbarie - Botanicals and Body Care
Natural Source & Specialty Bulk Ingredients...Exceptional Quality
at Wholesale Prices...visit us at http://www.theherbarie.com

Hi Guys.
Can anyone tell me the consistency of Body Butters? Are they like table
butter, softer, harder? How are they usually packaged?
Thanks.
Pat.
Peace, Joy, Serenity
House of Scents tm. Body Oils, Fragrance Oils, Incense, Candles, Soap, Etc.
pat@...
http://www.houseofscents.com/

Can you substitute the Cond. E-wax in total for the regular e-wax? Or would you
use say, half e-wax and half cond. e-wax? Is there a ratio I should stick with?
I am sort of reluctant to ask questions here, because I am very new at using
chemicals and such.
Thank you!
~Patti

actually, that could be a cute marketing ploy - like a soap version of a fortune
cookie, with little human versions of miracles written on wax paper and rolled
up inside ;)
otherwise, miracle soap sounds like a joke claim to me...
~risa

One of my customers tried to interest me in selling the "Miracle Soap"
and of course I declined and also told her that calling any product a
"Miracle" was totally against all FDA rules and regs. And they will not tell
you exactly what the ingredients are....probably just basic soap with a few
miracles throw in! LOL!
Sherry